tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post3297887759603662603..comments2023-12-17T16:13:06.670-05:00Comments on In a Godward direction: On Consents: Conscience, Consequences and CanonsTobias Stanislas Haller BSGhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08047429477181560685noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post-29251744669770461432010-02-16T12:53:37.297-05:002010-02-16T12:53:37.297-05:00Dahveed, yes, that is the process. I don't bel...Dahveed, yes, that is the process. I don't believe there is any requirement to reveal who gave consent. Those who are keeping track now are basing their tracking on statements from the parties themselves, I think. I believe LA has made comment about the number, but not the sources, of the standing committee consents.Tobias Stanislas Haller BSGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08047429477181560685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post-18363342964379300322010-02-16T12:32:06.528-05:002010-02-16T12:32:06.528-05:00The Diocese of Los Angeles is collecting the conse...The Diocese of Los Angeles is collecting the consents from Standing Committees, but the Presiding Bishop is receiving the consents from the bishops. Will they actually reveal who consented?Brother Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06333089314994730330noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post-69081511075702687002010-02-16T11:18:04.588-05:002010-02-16T11:18:04.588-05:00It is a bit confusing, and I may not have made it ...It is a bit confusing, and I may not have made it clearer! The point is this is not a "vote" per se, but rather the collection of a sufficient number of consents -- a majority of all bishops with jurisdiction, and a majority of all standing committees must "consent." A formal "withholding of consent" is expected, but only the consents are actually counted -- and an absolute majority is needed of both the bishops and the committees -- and by a date certain. In this way the weasels can do as I describe, getting their responses in late or not at all, and so engaging in the time-honored rite of simultaneous cake-possession and consumption.<br /><br />When the consents are given at General Convention it is far more difficult to play the weasel game, as the consent is given or withheld in the respective houses of bishops or deputies, and often in these contentious days a roll call or vote by orders is requested. The House of Deputies Rules of Order (Rule 40) do not allow for abstention -- every Deputy must vote on any and every matter before the House.<br /><br />Hope this clarifies the muddy waters of Episcopal Polity!Tobias Stanislas Haller BSGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08047429477181560685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post-69251584461841807582010-02-16T10:45:55.954-05:002010-02-16T10:45:55.954-05:00Tobias
But an abstention that is officially counte...Tobias<br />But an abstention that is officially counted as a No cannot be seen as anything other than a covert No, so there's no weasling-advantage achieved by not voting. Or am I misunderstanding this?Erika Bakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01812376497361267014noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post-57372383520937458562010-02-16T09:44:41.593-05:002010-02-16T09:44:41.593-05:00Erika, my point is that an abstention has the effe...Erika, my point is that an abstention has the effect of a no without actually being one. Remember, we are dealing with some squirrel-minded bishops in this case -- would they had the courage of conviction to let their Yes be Yes and their No, No.<br /><br />Another factor, which I did not mention, is the "bring it on" faction of the far right, who may vote Yes in the hopes that confirmation will hasten the Armageddon for which they long. It has been said that this happened in the election of +KJS, but I do not know of a certainty it is true.Tobias Stanislas Haller BSGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08047429477181560685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6786565.post-82160887446762169572010-02-16T07:16:46.438-05:002010-02-16T07:16:46.438-05:00If an abstention counts as a no-vote, then presuma...If an abstention counts as a no-vote, then presumably, abstaining Bishops will not be able to say that they did not vote against her.Erika Bakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01812376497361267014noreply@blogger.com